Ford responds to NHTSA’s investigation of the Mustang’s MT82 6-speed transmission
Back in August we reported that the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration was opening an investigation into the 2011+ Mustang’s Getrag MT82 6-speed manual transmission. Since the car’s introduction with the new transmission, owners have reported a variety of issues including binding gears, difficulty engaging in shifts and excessive noise and vibration. At the time Ford stated that they would “fully cooperate with the government as they review this matter.” Now Ford has issued an official response to the NHTSA investigation with a report detailing their investigation into the Mustang’s transmission problems, the problems discovered, and the actions taken to rectify the issues. While the report is quite extensive, we’ve broken down the basics of for you.
The basics of Ford’s response to NHTSA investigation of the Mustang’s MT82 transmission:
- Ford was aware of the problems via direct communication from customers and monitoring of online forums
- Approximately three percent of transmissions were affected
- Ford investigated a variety of issues and found issues with cold shifting, the clutch plate bolt, clutch stayout, and 5th gear synchronization (detailed below)
- Each of the problems was addressed (detailed below)
- Many other factors resulted in the reporting of problems, including driver effect, the skip-shift feature, the influence of online forums, vehicle modifications and abuse.
- None of the issues caused a safety risk
- Ford has no plans for modifications related to the Mustang or the MT-82 6-speed manual transmission in the next 120 days
Introduction Summary
Concurrent with the launch of these new powertrains, Ford undertook aggressive monitoring of customer feedback, not only being sent directly to Ford, but also through customer comments in a wide variety of forums such as social media and various Mustang enthusiast forums. Through these varied sources of information, Ford became aware of a range of customer observations pertaining to the new 6-speed transmission. These ranged from reports that the gear shift was “stiff”, that shift efforts were higher than expected when changing gears, to reports of “grinding or notchiness” while completing a gear shift. Although reports associated with shift quality concerns appear to affect a low percentage (approximately three percent) of the vehicles equipped with the MT82 transmission, Ford nevertheless undertook steps to understand the causes of these concerns and to implement improvement actions where appropriate.
Ford introduced new engines and transmissions for the 2011 model year to continue meeting higher ustomer expectations for vehicle performance while improving fuel economy. While some customers have expressed satisfaction concerns related to shift quality in these vehicles, analysis of the reports included in the response and a thorough understanding of the design and manufacture of these transmissions and shift controls show that the conditions observed by those customers does not result in an inability to shift into gear or in loss of motive power while driving, and, accordingly, there is no risk to safety associated with the manual transmissions in these vehicles.
Summary of Problems and Solutions from Ford
Cold Shifting Problems:
Approximately 44 percent of the reports indicated higher than expected shift efforts in “cold” ambient temperatures when the vehicle is first started. The MT-82 6-speed transmission was launched with thicker (higher viscosity) transmission fluid than was used previously to address a gear noise issue identified during development. Ford determined that the customer complaints of increased shift effort may have resulted from this higher viscosity fluid and ambient temperatures at or below 60 degrees F.
Solution:
While these initial “cold” shift efforts may be higher than the driver may have previously experienced, analysis found that the vehicles can be shifted into any desired gear without excessive effort. Nevertheless, Ford worked directly with dealers and customers in an effort to resolve individual concerns and manage the trade-off between the shift efforts and potential noise concerns. Ford subsequently issued TSB 11-3-18 informing technicians to use a lower viscosity fluid, which has appeared to have alleviated the concerns of customers who are not satisfied with “cold” shift efforts.
Clutch Plate Bolt Problems:
A number of reports identified by Ford alleged increasing difficulty selecting gears over time, along with clutch noise and clutch performance degradation. Investigation of these reports identified grinding or “notchy” gears that were found to be caused by clutch fasteners that had worked loose during vehicle operation. An investigation into the root of the cause identified an issue with the fastener/joint design at the clutch to flywheel interface that was exacerbated by the higher transmission input speeds provided by the new engines.
Solution:
A revised fastener was designed and put into production October 19, 2010. The revised fastener was concurrently made available for service and a special service message (21614) was issued to aid technicians in identifying the concern.
Clutch Stayout Problems:
Approximately 24 percent of the reports refer to an issue identified by Ford as “clutch stayout” where the rotating inertia of the clutch components can be higher than the spring force provided by the clutch pedal return spring when gears are shifted at engine speeds greater than approximately 4,000 rpm. Under these conditions the clutch will reengage when engine rpm is reduced to a speed where the clutch pedal return spring overcomes the rotating inertia of the clutch components. This condition does not prevent selection of any gear.
Solution:
An investigation into the root cause of these reports identified that variability in the spring forces in the population of clutch pedal return springs allowed some springs to be below the expected force values and allow the condition to occur. Replacement clutch pedal parts were made available and a revised spring design has been implemented.
5th Gear Problems:
Some of the customer feedback received by Ford alleged “grinding into gear” or “notchiness” during shifting not caused by the previous problems. Ford investigations identified some component quality issues relating to the synchronizers for fifth gear.
Solution:
Corrective action was taken
Other Possible Causes of Shifting Problems
Driver Effect:
Some vehicle evaluations by dealer service managers or field service engineers found that the driver’s shift quality concerns were caused by their own shifting behavior. The 6-speed design differs from its 5-speed predecessor in that it has a narrower gate – the distance to engage the 3-4 or 5-6 gates from the 1-2 gate is narrower than on the 5-speed transmission. Ford believes that many driver reports of shift quality issues may, in fact, pertain to the narrower shift gates and relocated reverse gear position of the new 6-speed transmission.
Skip-Shift:
To further improve fuel economy, Ford incorporated “skip-shift” technology into the new 6-speed transmission. A thorough review of the reports identified found that one percent mention the skip-shift feature. A common expression in these reports is that the operator did not notice the shift to second gear had been gated to fourth. However, the skip-shift feature is only active under certain circumstances and does not result in an inability to shift. Allegations that the skip-shift feature either causes missed shifts or causes the vehicle to slow and become a risk to safety are not supported by the parameters necessary for skip-shift to be activated.
Influence of Online Forums:
Base on the review of comments in social media resources, it is reasonable to conclude that online forums can significantly influence the numbers and nature of concerns reported to both Ford and the agency. In particular, participants in one blog not only advocated contacting either Ford or the agency to gain attention to the matter, but also suggested the type of information that should be included in their contacts. One forum observed by Ford included guidance to make sure to explain how their concern was a “safety issue”.
Vehicle Modifications, Abuse:
Ford expects that owners may make some modifications to their vehicles for a variety of reasons. Inspections of some complaint vehicles have found modifications that may negatively affect shift quality and clutch and transmission durability. In addition to improper vehicle modifications, inspection of complaint vehicles often finds evidence that a vehicle has been abused. As a consequence, some owners may be disappointed that the warranty coverage was denied, and some of the complaints received by Ford and the agency may result from the associated dissatisfaction.
Conclusion Summary
While there have been some customer satisfaction concerns with the MT82 6-speed transmission in the subject vehicles, none of the underlying causes result in an inability to shift into gear or loss of motive power. The issues identified by customers have related to higher than expected shift efforts on a “cold” transmission, clutch stayout at higher engine rpms, gear clash or grinding, the skip-shift feature, and backing out of the clutch plate bolts in some early production vehicles. While the latter condition potentially could result in an inability to shift into gear, it is a very rare occurrence and can only inhibit the ability to shift into gear after prolonged and obvious indication to a driver through vibration, increased shift efforts or gear clash or grinding.
As a result of Ford’s monitoring of these customer concerns, observations by dealer service personnel and Ford field service personnel, and vehicle inspections, we have concluded that the reports generally relate to custom unfamiliarity with the performance style shifter with its narrow gates, the skip-shift feature, vehicle modifications and vehicle abuse.
Diligent monitoring of many customer feedback sources caused Ford to immediately evaluate and address several of the customer concerns. Some customer vehicles have experienced more than one repair attempt to address a particular issue and, regretfully, some customers have not had the level of satisfaction that Ford desires. Ford is committed to continually monitoring its products to provide the highest level of customer satisfaction possible. That is the case with the MT82 manual transmission.
A review of the reports provided in response to this inquiry has found that the reports have continued to decline as each action was put into place by Ford. The 2012 model year field data, although immature, indicates the actions taken have been very effective.
In summary, all the actions to date have been implemented to address sources of customer dissatisfaction related to “shift quality” concerns. The concerns described in the reports to Ford do not result in an inability to shift into gear or loss of motive power and clearly do not present an unreasonable safety risk. This observation is supported by the fact that there are no reports of any highway accidents or injuries related to this concern, even with the broadest definition of the alleged defect utilized to search for reports.
You can download the full report and response from Ford here.
Related posts
- Ford issues TSB for 2011+ Mustangs to resolve cold shifting problems
- NHTSA opens investigation into the 2011 Mustang's transmission problems
- NHTSA drops investigation of 2011+ Mustang's 6-speed MT-82 transmission
- Ford issues recall for some 2012-2013 Mustangs for reverse gear problems
Greetings. First of all I’m 59 years old. I bought a 2012 Boss 302 in August 2011. I now have 4300 miles on the car and I love it. The transmission was kind of stiff at first but it has become easier to shift the more miles I put on it.
The one thing that irritates me is the skip-shift. When I accelerate around town in first gear and try to shift to 2nd, I never know if I’m going to get 2nd (which would be the proper gear for the situation) or 4th. I usually have to down shift if I wined up in 4th because it lugs the engine. I get very frustrated with this so-called feature. Lately I have been starting out in 2nd gear so I don’t get so frustrated shifting. Can this feature be disabled by the dealer so as not to void the warranty? I have read on some of the forums that you can disconnect a plug at the top of the transmission.
Thank you
I have a 2012 Boss,and have experienced,hard and grinding,from 1st-
2nd gear. Worse when cold,however it occurs randomlly during shifting.
Disappointed, that Ford put a grill w/blanks for fog/driving lights
that will not accept the lights,plus deleated the oil pressure& guages.
I see that they are adding Sync next year.
How dare they decide when I can shift into second and when I can’t … I’m so frustrated. When I drive home from work in my 2011 5.0 and I’m starting from a stoplight – If I am not racing – the car skips second and goes into fourth … that is unbelievable to me. It’s like censorship. And, by-the-way, no one explained that to me before I bought the car. I learned how to drive on a Model A (no, I’m not that old) and then moved on to a C type Jag with no synchro between 1 and 2nd … I think I know how to shift and feel confident that I can select the proper gear at the proper time.
thanks for letting my vent
I had a Camaro years ago with this skip shift feature and thought the car was broke after taking delivery. This feature should be covered by the dealer with the customer before any purchase is made. I’m holding off on my 2012 mustang purchase to see how Ford handles the issues. It seems the customer gets blamed for the problems; which ends up (in many cases), to be a bad design by the car companies.
My 2012 GT keeps getting smoother with every mile. I have 3000 miles on it now and I am being extra careful with the break in. Skip shift could be a pain, but I am starting in 2nd most of the time now. Just use 1st for a really quick launch or uphill. The drive train is a little noisy. It doesn’t grind or miss gears but a little clucking if I don’t finesse the shift. Over all I am very happy with my ride.
I was about to buy a new v6 mustang before I read the story about the transmission investigation, which made me back out of the deal. Ford needs to step up and issue a better transmission than this Chinese built piece of garbage or I will take my money elsewhere.
I’m very disappointed with Ford’s response, their “solutions” are just short term fixes to keep the transmissions functioning until they get out of warranty. Also, to lash out against their customers and “social media” is a great way to completely alienate the few die hard Ford fans left.
Whoever is in charge of mishandling this investigation response and sourcing these horrible transmissions should be sacked.
Anyone else having any problems with clutch slipping in a 2012 BOSS? I’m having the same notchy clunky shifts, regardless of the 1-4 issue (I’ve started shifting 1-3 to get around this in town).
In the first couple of hundred miles, the car smelled hot (hotter than my 6-10 mile careful drive should) but i assumed it was just bedding-in. Now, 500 miles in, its a definite clutch smell, and when accelerating 2-4th gears, the clutch is definitely, if not disastrously, slipping.
Any thoughts before I go back to the dealer?
On 1/2/2012 one week ago my 2011 Mustang with 2480 miles went to Gaudin Ford for repair as neither I nor my wife were able to get into reverse and it was grinding into other gears. The pressure plate to flywheel bolt were replaced along with the tranmission gear oil changed to a lower viscosity. The automobile now shifts better than ever. So whats my complaint you ask? Gaudins Asst. Serv. Mgr. will not return my phone calls or provide me with details of the repair. Further, Gaudins Service Manager will not return my call either. I also received a call from Ford asking about whether I was satisfied, I replied “No” and mentioned the type of repair, requesting I be called back due to a poor phone connection. Guess what?? I’ve yet to receive a return call from Ford either. Here’s my concern: The repair order indicates inspection of the pressure plate and the clutch disc but NO mention as the the inspection of the “Flywheel Bolt Hole Threads”. 3 of the 6 bolts were found to be loose which prevented shifting. If the integrity of these threads were compromised how safe is the fix and how long might the repair last? A number of 2011 owners have had their ponys back for bolts now 3 times. If this is Ford Motor Company’s idea of Quality is Job 1 .. perhaps they will talk with Gaudin so that myself and my wife can better sleep knowing that the fix was proper and that a pressure plate and clutch disc isn’t going to break loose exploding thru the bellhousing cutting off a leg or foot at 4000 rpm. don’t you think?
So as of 1-24-2012 this problem still hasn’t been totally fixed on these 6 speeds????
No, it’s apparently not fixed. My 2012 Boss 302 was built September 2011 and now has 1800 miles on it. I am having problems with both gear clash or grinding, and with the clutch dragging with the pedal on the floor.
I just bought a 2012 GT Premium with 6 speed This car has 1500 miles on it and the car experiences gear clash when upshifting to third under strain. Also, the gears crunch twice when hifting into 1st or 2nd while moving or sitting still. What should I do?
I’m scared to death to now buy a new 2012 Boss after reading about all these problems. I was literally within a few hours of going to the dealership when I came upon all these articles and posts about the MT82.
I really ticked cause now I won’t buy one and I had my heart set on it $%#&###$))%$
Ford Lost Me Too! I Was Looking Seriously At A 6 Speed GT Premium But Who Needs This Kind Of Aggravation After Spending 35K!!
I am on my THIRD MT82 in my 2011 and I am currently losing 6th gear…. LEMON TO THE MAXXXXXX.
Lost me as a customer going back to Chevy Camaro Hope I get get a decent price on trade but salesman knew of M82 trans problems so I am expecting a big loss. Thanks Ford
I’ve had my 2012 GT into two different dealerships now, each telling me there is nothing wrong with the transmission as the same grinding into second and third gears also occurs on other new GTs on their lot. I love everything else about this car but this grinding into gear issue makes me regret buying the car every day. There was a poster at the dealership where I bought it last summer that read “make your commute a vacation”, great idea, but when you grind though half the gears from every stop light, it feels like a really bad vacation! I’m very disappointed with Ford. Why don’t they fix this obvious problem on an otherwise fantastic car?
After buying a new 2011 BMW 335i and keeping it for 10 months, I was so disenchanted with the “ultimate driving machine” that I decided to trade it in on a 2012 Mustang GT. All I can say is…
WOW!
This car is such a joy to drive compared to the BMW. The leather interior is far superior, and it’s a beautiful car to look at. It drives great and the power is unbelievable.
Keep in mind that I’m a Baby Boomer (63) who grew up with American Muscle Cars. Ford has stepped up and delivered something fabulous with the new 5.0.
Regardin the transmission: I currently have owned the car for about a month and have put 448 miles on the odometer. During that time, I have experienced the skip-shift feature on one occasion. If you’re not aware, your instrument panel will give you a readout that says 1-4 skip shift. As long as that readout is visible, it’s going to engage. I never knew that until the other day, but still, haven’t had any issue with the skip-shift feature. In addition, I’ve only had gear grinding on two occasions. Both times, I believe it was “pilot error” because I did not depress the clutch fully.
I see a lot of posts on the Mustang forums regarding issues with this transmission. Fortunately, I’ve had none and I love the close ratio shifter Ford put in. Unless it falls apart in a few thousand miles, I don’t anticipate any issues in the future.
I have had a lot of bad shifts, mostly when shifting hard.Why put junk in such a beutiful piece of steel? Trans is being changed to the 6060 out of the gt500.Has anybody had starting problems? I’ve had the starter spin with no engagment. Ford said they had to reflash the pcm. The starter is controlled by the pcm?, how wonderful.
almost bought 2012 v6 mustang stick shift,thank god i researched this vehicle other than its horsepower and MPG LOLOLOL guess i will settle on a 350z or wait for the 370 to get a little cheaper.The v6 camaro is fat, slow and expensive.I am considering a mazda MS3 but not sure about them either.
I bought a 12′ Boss 302 last summer with the hopes that Ford would have fixed any of these trans issues in production, guess I was wrong. The car had always felt notchy and shifting between gears has always just felt off. I attributed this to having never driven a new mustang with an MT-82. I accepted this as the norm since the car, although notchy, drove fine. Fast forward to yesterday and for the first time I experienced a hard grind from 1st to 2nd while cold. The next 15 miles the car shifted perfectly and I figured it was the Cold Shift problem stated above, something I was planning on speaking with my service department about.
I then proceeded to get on the highway with a “spirited” throttle ringing third out to get up to speed a little quicker. Make the 3rd to 4th shift and it acts as if I missed a gear. It aggravated me but always one to blame myself, I figured it was driver error, even though I’ve driven nothing but standard vehicles for 8 years now. Then, once I was about to get off the highway, after cruising the whole way in 6th Since the incident I realize there’s a serious problem. Down shifting into 4th the trans pops out of gear and grinds as I let the clutch out. 3rd grinds badly with the clutch fully depressed at speed, EVERY single time now. The car will drive in third and when it doesn’t pop out of fourth upon releasing the clutch it will drive as well. Although there’s obviously a serious problem and have the common sense to avoid both gears.
I’m now terrified to deal with Ford. Reading online what seem like horror stories of Ford shrugging issues like this off as normal. My first initial dealings with my local service department was also disheartening. I don’t expect everyone to be up to date with everything but the guy acted like this was the first issue they’ve ever heard of, claiming they’ve never had anyone come back with issues. Fair enough, if it’s really 3% as Ford claims then I’m the unlucky one with the problem in my area. But they also fed me a bunch of other bull I won’t bother going into here that makes me scared it’ll never be fixed without money out of my own pocket.
For what it’s worth the car had 2850 miles on it at the time of experiencing the problem. Although Fords claims of the Boss 302 paying homage to the 69′ and being a glorified “road racer” for the street, it’s not what sold me on the car. I’ve never had plans on racing it from day one, I’ve babied the car since new and have only really felt what the car had to offer performance wise a handful of times. Sadly I’ve never felt confident shifting this car at higher RPM’s with how notchy and imprecise the gearbox felt. Maybe I should have spoken up sooner?
Anyway this is my experience so far. I’ve yet to allow Ford to fix the problem as I have no time off work to bring her in yet. I can’t speculate on how they will treat me either but my current attitude towards the situation isn’t hopeful after reading what the Internet had to say.
I waited many years to get my new 2012 Mustang GT. I ordered the one I wanted factory fresh. Six speed transmission, Brembo brakes and Ford’s “Premium Package”. I love my car! It is beautiful and powerful. I am 52 years old and treat it like a baby. I don’t race it or abuse it in any way (never even spun the tires!). However, when I shift from first to second, the gears grind slightly. Even if I very deliberatley push in the clutch all the way to the floor and slowly pull into second, it will grind. It happens frequently but randomly. Ford dealer says “no problem found”. Scratching my head.
Hey everyone, this sort of thing really freaked me out just 2 WEEKS before the car came. I ordered it in oct. of 2011, brand new form the factory and 2 weeks as stated I started to see these transmission problem forums when I was looking for the cueball shifter for the car. and after seeing all these videos I was heart broken, whats the point in having 412 horse power IF I CAN”T USE IT!?. no responce from ford. and the people at the dealer were a bunch of arrogant jerks. I backed out sadly lost my downpayment and switched over to a new 392 Hemi SRT8 Challenger with the tremec. now WHY does the gt500 have a tremec which is tested and prooven and go to this pile of trash from getrag that is built in china? made me wonder if I R/T challenger costs 5 grand more for the same sort of options. what is Fords skimping on?
B-man
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